Comments on: Does God Exist? Proof & Evidence for the Existence of God

By: Callum

Callum — Sun, 19 May 2013 14:26:26 +0000

God didn’t help discover the planets shape at all, yet alone any other science. Brave humans that were willing to question what was seen as “true” discovered it. Religion has adapted to science not the other way around, remember what happened when the forces of nature were discovered? The pope tried to declare them a heresy and eventually the catholic and christian religion just said “well actually we can’t beat that logic so now God made those forces.” – Science has done more for humanity in 100 years than religion has done for humanity in the past 10,000 years… wait sorry i forgot according to the bible the world is only 6000 years old *cough*.
Don’t go allocating credit to a god that doesn’t deserve it. People like Einstein, Stephen Hawking..etc they’re the ones truly discovering and working toward a more advanced and knowledgeable humanity.

By: Jim van ommen

Jim van ommen — Sun, 19 May 2013 11:19:07 +0000

So did those of that era who didn’t write the Bible.
However, together we have come to the conclusion that planet Earth is indeed not flat.
Just imagine what else we might discover if we work together with an open mind, pocket our pride and listen to what our Creator God has yet got in store for us.

By: Callum

Callum — Sun, 19 May 2013 06:25:19 +0000

Also your planet theory is flawed seeing as the people who wrote the bible thought the world was flat. Good thing Science fixed it.

By: Callum

Callum — Sun, 19 May 2013 06:07:14 +0000

This is the most stupid article I've ever read. Most of the information is wrong and [expletive removed] - A) Right and wrong can be biologically explained - B) No one is saying everything happened by chance you're just educated. There are hundreds of thousands of planets capable of sustaining life. The earth is not special or unique. Grow up and stop [expletive removed] arguments to justify your imaginary friends.

By: Jim van Ommen

Jim van Ommen — Thu, 16 May 2013 05:43:40 +0000

Richard you said, quote:
“Doubt is the great motivator for advancement of knowledge. You say we can waist too much time trying to understand things that are beyond our capacity to comprehend. If everyone thought like that we’d still be dying of infected cuts and your heart surgeon wouldn’t exist. You wouldn’t be using the internet…..etc.”
Yes, you’re right yet billions of people have lived that way since the beginning of time and I don’t think it would be right to look upon them as a people who, by virtue of the era in which they lived were under privileged or deprived in any way, were they? I don’t really need to think very hard to think of many inventions and practices that would suggest the very opposite.
Christians of all times believe that the importance is not how long we live, or what we die of, or what we invent, but the quality and purpose of life that leads beyond the grave to everlasting life with our Creator God. John 3:16
How do I know that? Yes, here I guess we part our ways, but I would like to point you to what I have said earlier on this website, on the 6th Oct. 2012 in respect of proof and faith.
Regards, Jim.

By: Richard

Richard — Wed, 15 May 2013 22:33:10 +0000

Jamie,
Contrary to what you say, we have created life to some extent:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/7745868/Scientist-Craig-Venter-creates-life-for-first-time-in-laboratory-sparking-debate-about-playing-god.html
We must remember that nature took perhaps billions of years of random events to create the tiniest spark of life that then took further millions of years to evolve in to us. So for us to have come as far as we have in only a few hundred years of science is quite spectacular.
You are right; I will argue that just because we don’t know something there is no reason to fill the knowledge gap with a god. There is just no reason to do that other than laziness.
I can’t argue that your life has become more meaningful because of a belief in a god. It still doesn’t indicate the existence of gods, just your need to believe in something bigger than yourself. If that works for you, that’s fine. As long as you keep in mind that belief in something without evidence is basically a delusion.
Contrary to what you say, I think it’s much scarier to realise that we have no one leading the way. No one to thank or blame. There is no purpose. We must all simply take responsibility for our lives. There is no second chance when we die. Just look at how many religions and gods the world has had over the centuries. We all want someone to look after us. This only proves humanity’s needs, not the existence of gods (unless we are going to accept as real, all the gods through history).
Do you honestly think your particular god has a purpose for you? How do you know what purpose that is? I am very interested in your response to these questions.
Jim,
Doubt is the great motivator for advancement of knowledge. You say we can waist too much time trying to understand things that are beyond our capacity to comprehend. If everyone thought like that we’d still be dying of infected cuts and your heart surgeon wouldn’t exist. You wouldn’t be using the internet.
Would you let me operate on you because I told you to have faith that I was a heart surgeon? I don’t think you would. You’d want to know that I’d studied for many years and was qualified for the job. If you had any doubts about my ability you could find proof of my qualifications. You don’t need to know everything the surgeon knows, but you do need to know that the surgeon is a surgeon

By: Jamie

Thu, 09 May 2013 15:00:46 +0000

Well if we are really honest with ourselves Richard we have to admit that life does not occur in the natural world–or at least in a world created by purely natural forces. No matter how hard scientists have tried to recreate the original environment in which chemicals combined together to become the building block amino acids from which life is formed they have never been successful. The problem is that all natural processes used to create amino acids can only produce a 50/50 split of left and right handed amino acids. And yet all proteins are made up of only left-handed amino acids. Right and left handed amino acid molecules lack chirality and therefore cannot combine to make the complex shapes of proteins. Conversely, DNA nucleotides are exclusively right handed molecules but all natural processes create a 50/50 split of right and left handed nucleotide molecules. There is no way that the complex helix spiral of the DNA could be made out of both right and left-handed molecules.

Not only that but the experiments used to create that 50/50 split of right and left-handed amino acids were absolutely destructive to life. The high levels of methane and ammonia used in the experiment of Stanley Miller and Harold Urey would have destroyed any proteins that could have possibly been formed by the resulting amino acids.

There are no known natural processes that could have made exclusively left-handed amino acids that are needed for the development of proteins and no known natural process that could have created those amino acids within an environment that is safe for the development of life. So the existence of life just on that basis needs some unnatural force–I would suggest a supernatural force–to create these basic building blocks. As far as being repeatable, well the vast number of proteins and DNA say that whatever–or whomever–was able to introduce chiral amino acids and nucleotides was able to do it again and again and again.

And that is just one of the components of our ‘pond’ that does not occur in the natural world.

Now I assume you will suggest that we just haven’t found out yet what natural processes created the building blocks of life and that this is not of itself a proof that God made amino acids with proper chirality. But right now, we have to look at those and admit that something outside of what we know has done this, which could very well point to the existence of God. The more we look at the universe around us and begin to add up all the parts that cannot be explained by natural processes we eventually have to admit this is no puddle, it’s a pond!

The problem that so many people have with that is we then have to ask, “Who made our pond and what purpose does He have for us?” For all of us who are born with a desire to be the master of our own purpose and destiny, that is too scary of a question to face. We don’t want to have to conform to anybody else’s plan for our lives and so we keep on discounting the evidence and search for ways to describe our pond as a puddle. But what I have found is that when I was able to admit that our pond was made by God and began to investigate who He is and what His purpose is for me, a whole new reality of life opened up. It transformed the ways I related to the universe around me, other people in my life and myself. Looking to God for His direction and seeing His love for me expressed in a myriad of ways has brought a vibrancy to life that I could never have had otherwise.

By: Richard

Richard — Thu, 09 May 2013 09:25:55 +0000

Jamie,
Thanks for the even tempered response.
However, the pond in your back yard is clearly man made. There is a direct link to the manufacturer. It’s repeatable. We could have one made just like it. It’s made of materials that don’t occur in the natural world – plastic and rubber and probably rocks that have been cut with metal tools and cemented together. It’s unlikely that you’d find a natural pond with any of these elements, and if you did it would be reasonable to assume that it too was man made. Natural puddles will have none of these things and could be shown to have occurred though weathering or other natural act – no manufacturer needed.
So the point is, if some water (people) trickles in to a puddle (our world) there is no reason to think the puddle was created for the water. The conditions were right for the water to be trapped in the puddle, that’s all.
While I concede that it’s possible that for reasons unknown a greater power created the universe, then left it to evolve for billions of years; the likelihood is so remote and the evidence so non-existent that it doesn’t really warrant considering.
Given the vastness of the universe and the infinite possibilities it represents, the chances of life arising accidentally seems immeasurably more likely than it being created by a god.
And whether one is more likely than the other, the fact is there is no evidence of any gods existence.
Having said that, I’m open to hear any convincing argument. By the way -“The world is so beautiful and works so well, it must be god’s creation” Is not a convincing argument.
I love to think and debate about this subject, so I hope you’ll respond again.
Richard

By: Jim van Ommen

Jim van Ommen — Thu, 09 May 2013 01:52:26 +0000

Hi Jamie,

I like your analogy, spot on and very difficult to argue with even on the basis of the theory of probability and analysis of random happening.
I agree, there is no doubting that there was a purpose in the design of you and me and all of us, as well as our ecosystem, but Richard, we can waist too much precious time in trying to understand things that are beyond our capacity to comprehend. When we have this attitude that we must know all the details of God’s creation before we acknowledge Him for who He is and His purpose for us,we will stunt our growth spiritually. It’s like me saying to my doctor before I had my heart surgery: Doc. I will not go for this until I fully understand all aspects of this surgery and know all that you know. I think he would give my bed a gentle push sideways and say; Next !
No, on second thoughts God is not like that, but He might say, come back when you are ready….. that’s if you get the chance.( theory of probability?….trade it in for faith) If pride is the obstacle, get rid of it, before ……………

By: Jamie

Wed, 08 May 2013 19:14:10 +0000

Hi Richard, I actually have a “puddle” created in my yard that was specifically designed to be a puddle–ok, we call it a pond–and shows all kinds of evidence that it does indeed have a purpose to its design. If the puddle in my yard looked at its rubber lining, rock surrounding and pump creating the fountain, it could surmise that it was created for a specific purpose.

Now I suppose that some other puddle could try to convince my pond that it all happened by accident and that it is deluded in thinking that it has a purpose but the sheer amount of elements that point to a specific purpose would be difficult to argue with.

While I concede that it is possible that our universe and all of the factors needed for life to exist on our planet came together by accident, I am swayed by the volume of elements that needed to come together in order for life here to be a reality, for us to explore and understand the universe we are in, and to connect with the One who created it all. To dismiss all of those elements as pure chance seems to denote a closed mind to the possibility of something divine. Are you saying that it is impossible for there to exist a God powerful enough, intelligent enough, and loving enough to create us and a universe for us to live in and enjoy relationship with Him?