Can You Connect to God Without Religion?

Written by Karen Schenk

soulcravingsfindreligionIs there a difference between God and Religion? There is definitely a difference between God and religion.  God is someone I have a relationship with.  My view on God can be altered by many factors in my life.  It can be affected by my relationship with my own father or even by my culture and the people I spend time with.

I see religion is a set of beliefs that have guidelines for behavior associated with them.    There are many religions with many differing beliefs and rules.   I don’t  think God needs religion.  He wants to have a relationship with me.   It is so easy for me to get confused and think that my relationship with him has rules of engagement.    I love knowing that God cares about me and that my relationship with him does not need a lot of order and structure.  I want to participate in religion or church to celebrate his holiness, but it’s not a condition of knowing God.  Do you believe you can you connect to God without religion?

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931 Responses to “Can You Connect to God Without Religion?”

  • Phil, This is a question every individual asks and the religious institutions try to answer. It is answered with spirit, holy ghost, several GODs (the devil), mysticism, and others imagining or searching scriptures to understand what the afterlife might be like. At the time of human death your essence is transferred back to the Creator. Void of human ego, desires and property; the ultimate goal is that your essence becomes one with your Creator. As we become closer to achieving this goal and return to the Creator at the end of our human life, the depth of the love, joy, and the feeling of wellbeing are so great that they are unimaginable as a human being. The lack of this relationship is not a punishment, but a absence of fulfillment; an absence of the glory of GOD.

    Phil, what is your intention in this discussion?

  • Phil says:

    Seemingly you look at words nor phrase very deeply, and tend to overlook and forget to put yourself in other people’s perspective. “As long as..” to me and those conditions that you think, aren’t my basis of good nor bad, its my way of living in my own perspective trying to help as long as i can nor avoiding to offend other people you forgot i said “etc.” so the “six activities” that you think are not just six.. The list goes on and on depending on your own views and how you live your life the way you want it to be and how you think God wants you to be, i just cited examples of my own view. Now, regarding of the outcome, why would i think of that? Honestly it doesn’t matter to me whether what happens to me when i die, no one is 100% exactly knows what is really going to happen anyway, I dont think too much of it. My own view, as I said earlier, I’ll just summarize, I want to live my life as I think in my own personal ways what God wants me to be, life is simple to me, it becomes complicated because of the people that makes it nor want it to be complicated and always wants to be ahead of one another. Life is not a competition for me there is always a place for each and everyone of us. Whether you digest what I said or not, I dont really mind. I’m just telling my views that it doesn’t take a religion just to know, praise and give thanks to God.

  • Tom Tom says:

    William Goodenough—
    Intrinsically, I would agree with most of what you wrote. But let me ask what I asked Phil: What’s the ultimate purpose for, or reason of, understanding certain things about God and acting out on those understandings to others in the world. If we are “one with God,” or if we never become “one with God,” what is the ultimate consequence beyond this life?

  • Tom Tom says:

    Phil—
    Thanks for your input.

    You wrote, “As long as . . .” and then you listed six activities. The “as long as” seems to indicate a good or bad consequence, dependent on your activities. What’s the ultimate outcome supposed to be, either way?

  • Phil, It is good to hear one other person with similar views. Tom, being ‘one with GOD’ is understanding that all people are equal, and were born with infinite and equal blessings, understanding that GOD is infinite energy and unconditional love, and understanding that continually asking GOD for more is disrespectful. Being ‘one with GOD’ is thanking GOD from your heart every day for his blessings and living your life learning and practicing unconditional love; not because you read it some place, not because it makes you feel better than other people, and not for any other selfish reason. We are born in GOD’s image, our purpose is to be ‘one with GOD’in our mind and in our heart. The devil is in the details, the details are in the church. I hope the best for you and that something I have said in this brief explanation will resonate with you and help you find your way to GOD.

  • Phil says:

    Same here, I believe in God but not in any religion, I believe God has plans for each in everyone of us. As long as you dont hurt people, do good, help one another, talk about His goodness, love each other, accept that everything is happening for a reason etc. that wraps about it. Religion has cause too much pain, suffering, sorrow,WAR, conflict and so on and so forth.. does God want you to do those things? Just to prove which is which? As long you understand Who is God and God is LOVE then I think you’d fully understand what you are preaching about. Preaching w/o applying it to you’re own life and continuously mocking & hurting other people I guess is the true hypocrisy of your belief.

  • Tom Tom says:

    William Goodenough–

    You have yet to define what you mean by “becoming one with your creator.”

  • Tom: Yes, you have expressed your churches interpretation of the perfect scriptures. You said: I’ve heard many people used the phrase “become one with God” meaning they basically become God themselves. I responded to that originally. So please give me your definition of “becoming one with God.”

    Your first comments reflected your ‘I have perfect knowledge, and I must teach this ignorant person of the true path to GOD. You asked what you thought were intelligent questions probing my ignorant position so that you could correct me. Then you demeaned me by suggesting that I might want to become GOD myself. This elitist attitude is not in keeping with ‘do unto others as you would have them do unto you’, but it is the typical religious attitude. It is a perfect example of a stumbling block to becoming one with your creator.

  • Tom Tom says:

    Bill Goodenough–
    I think it would do this conversation much good if we both defined our terms.

    What I mean by “follow God” is to know him better both through prayer, scripture, and the Holy Spirit; by doing things that will please him; by sharing about him with others; my desiring an ever growing relationship with him through Jesus Christ; the list would go on. (Sorry, I’ve been really sick all week and my mind doesn’t last too long right now.)

    I’ve heard many people used the phrase “become one with God” meaning they basically become God themselves. I responded to that originally. So please give me your definition of “becoming one with God.”

  • Tom: There is more than a causal relationship between GOD and religion. You say ‘follow GOD because he loves me so much’ and I said ‘become one with GOD’. What in the world does ‘follow GOD’ mean to you? Do you mean that if one follows GOD they cannot become or should or cannot become one with GOD? Please explain what the enormous difference is in the way you perceive these expressions.

  • Tom Tom says:

    Bill Goodenough—
    Glad you didn’t fall out of your chair. You could get hurt like that.

    You wrote, “If you have any other reason for following a religion,” Are we talking about God or about religion? Are you lumping the two together?

    What if I want to follow God because he loves me so much? Is that selfish? It certainly isn’t desiring to become one with God.

    Still not understanding why my first post was such a shock to you, I’d like to ask you again—where do you get the idea our goal is to “become one with God?” Just what do you mean by that anyway?

  • Tom,

    ‘Become one with GOD’. I almost fell out of chair when I read your reply. If you have any other reason for following a religion, you will find that it is selfish, i.e. entry to heaven, makes me feel good, helps me handle tragic incidents of my life, being saved to a perfect world after Christs return to earth, gives me courage, etc. GOD blesses you with being a human in his image. The most important of these bundle of blessings is the ability of unconditional love; the love you give your parents at birth. I learned this lesson through meditation and prayer. GOD blesses with so much at birth, asking for more is disrespectful. Every prayer should be ‘thankyou’, counting your blessing is always good.

  • Tom Tom says:

    Bill Goodenough—
    You make some interesting observations here. While there are several points to be considered, may I ask what I think is the most important questions regarding your post?

    You write that “doing unto others . . .” “is the first step in becoming one with GOD.” However, why do you belief that? What is your evidence to support such a claim, since neither Christianity, Judaism, or any type of Islam teaches that a person’s goal should be to “become one with God?”

  • The ‘Image of God’ is a concept and theological doctrine in Judaism, Christianity, and Sufi Islam, which asserts that human beings are created in the image and likeness of God. Regardless of the exact meaning of being made in the Image of God, the concept is a foundational doctrine of both Christianity and Judaism. The message ‘Do unto others as you would have them do under you’ is found in all religions. This is the first step in becoming one with GOD, you do not need a religion or a Jesus Christ’ to accomplish this goal.

  • G says:

    A simpler perspective: God – that neat little label we put on the marvelously inexplicable – doesn’t belong to a religion.

    Cogitate that.

  • Tom Tom says:

    Ron—
    Webster’s New World Dictionary has this as its first two definitions of “religion”:
    1-belief in a divine or superhuman power or powers to be obeyed and worshiped as the creator and ruler; 2-any specific system of belief and worship, often involving a code of ethics and a philosophy.

    By definition 1, if you truly believe in God then you are by default religious. I would guess you just do not practice your faith with an organization of other like-minded believers. But if not, then how do you know what you believe is true? What standard are you using to define God and his attributes? How do you know what, if anything, he expects of you?

  • Ron says:

    I truly believe in God without religion. There is an experience that some people have had, it goes by a lot of different names. The feeling of all pain leaving the body, absolute peace beyond any feeling they’ve known, feeling like you see the world from thousands of feet above and knowing that everything is perfect, electricity surging through your body, the sound of wind and thunder. Time feels like it stops, you know exactly who God is, and that empty space inside you has just found the part that fits perfectly. Then it ends, and you spend the rest of your life longing for that again. Whats left of the world is gray and empty by comparison to this. Jeremiah Denton talks about this, it was the conclusion of the movie Martyrs. Its been called Uncreated Light, and is best described in a book called, “The Cloude of Unknowing”.

  • Sharon says:

    good article and thank you all who comment on this thread bless you all– sharon

  • robin theus says:

    I want to connect with those in the Dallas that believe this way, the way I believe. Is there anyone from Texas.

  • Tom Tom says:

    Justin–
    You may not be familiar with King Solomon, but his musings on life were very similar to what you’re expressing. (Read the Book of Ecclesiastes in the Bible for what he had to say.)

    If we’re brought up to not believe in anything greater than ourselves, then we come to discover that in and of ourselves, there’s not really much to hang onto. Although man has done some pretty impressive things, he’s also done an awful lot of evil and worthless things. What’s more, if man simply evolved from lower species, then there’s really not anything particularly better about us anyway–we just happen to have reached this particular moment in the evolutionary process and there’s no hope of anything beyond our short little lives.

    I came to discover that there really is meaning to life, and there’s something great to look forward to after this life. It’s not all just chasing after the wind as Solomon wrote.

    Are you ready to consider that there is a Creator who made you for a purpose and who wants a personal relationship with you?

  • justin thorning says:

    I need a great change in my life. Tired of empty pursuits and feeling disconnected. While I have been brought uap to not believe in any higher power; it has nonetheless left me bereft of a “soul”. Want to feel a healthy connection with persons that understand there is something more than just our simple and self-driven goals. Want to be connected to something beyond my simple self. Anyone out there?

  • EAGLE FALCON says:

    WE THANK YOU GOD OUR CREATOR AND OF THE UNIVERSE FOR ALL THE GOODNESS THAT YOU DO FOR US. PLEASE HELP US KEEP AWAY FROM EVIL AND HELP US TO BE GOOD. LOTS OF LOVE

  • Tom Tom says:

    Actually, God made sure the scriptures are easy enough to understand so that a person can know him and have a saving relationship with Jesus Christ. It is man’s sinfulness and Satan’s deceit that causes confusion–our desire and his desire to BE like God rather than to OBEY him.

    As for the money given to churches: churches have expenses. The pastor is to be paid. (Scripture tells us that the workman is worthy of his wages.) While the Mormon, Jehovah’s Witness, and Roman Catholic churches use a disproportionate percentage of their income to build fancy edifices and line pockets, true Christian denominations use the money for the Lord’s work in one way or another.

    Let me ask–if one is to connect to God via meditation, how do you know when you’ve connected with him? How do you know you aren’t “connecting” to the devil?

  • Sharon says:

    to Bill goodenough. thank you for your email you didn’t offend me but its ok if you did. ok the money going to say our conference goes to them but its for mission works and that is it and for the catholic churches I am sure the money that the pope gets is to let him live in the Vatican his life to live and the upkeep of the Vatican. most churches I attended were broke most of the time there is no money for the personal gain of anyone. and in the new testament is JESUS sometimes quotes the old testament you didn’t tell me on what verses are confusing and misleading I grew up in a Christian home and went to church all of my life so I know a little bit if this I am sorry you don’t believe I am still praying for you. sharon

  • Sharon, I did not mean to offend you, sorry. In nearly all churches, a portion, normally a %, of the contributions go to the higher church management. In the Catholic Church, it is the vatican. In your church, I have no idea. You might ask your leaders how this works in your church. The confusion part of the scriptures are the reason we have many church organizations and Christian denominations that expose’ different beliefs; different versions of the bible, new and old testiments.

  • Sharon says:

    to bill goodenough. what part of scripture is confusing and misleading. show me please on what is misleading and confusing. ok I don’t know about the catholic church but the churches I attend we collect money for charities and to handle the church like operating it and for the pastors salary if you don’t want to believe that that is your decision I am still praying for you– sharon

  • Sharon, I said “The scriptures are confusing and misleading and the churches seek personal gain; therefore, the only true path to God is direct and personal. I am truly a witness.” If the scriptures were not confusing the world would only have a single, united definition, one religion, one conclusion. As for personal gain, the Catholic Church is richer than most countries, having international influence. Other churches are striving for the same financial goals. GOD is unlimited energy and power, and unconditional love (unconditional forgiveness). He is never to be feared. Human existence is temporary, the spirit (essence) is eternal. Unconditional love is a blessing you were given when you were born. This is the essence of GOD. I am very aware of, and have on my computer (at my finger tips), the scriptures for Christianity, Judaism, Muslimism Asian, Scientology, and other ideological concepts.

  • Sharon says:

    to Bill goodenough your comment is interesting to read. we can become on with God through is spirit we can’t be God but one with him in what HE does through the bible you say the bible is confusing and misleading how????? and the churches are in it for their personal gain how? most money collected goes to missions and for the salary of the leaders of the church and to operate the church nothing more if churches do use the money for their personal I would think that I think the IRS or some tax revenue would get after them and the people of the church would maybe kick out the leaders who do that but I think most churches are good with the money I am sorry you got hurt if you did by churches and if you can’t read a bile because its old English trying reading a bible called the message by Eugene Peterson or the new international version or the English standard version. I am praying for you. it is also nice to be among other Christians for fellowship and encouragement. sharon

  • H Moradi says:

    I think all major religions that we know, are being saved by God up to these days, If we assumed they are not from God. They all carry good messages for us to live by and they are
    BELIEVE, LOVE and HONESTY and all related branches of these three factors in every single holy book.
    However every single person belonging to their own religions worship their religions beliefs but not to God.
    They don’t come to introduce you to God, they come to you to introduce you to their religion, although if you believing God is not good enough for them ,
    It is the time we all believe the UNITY FAITH and follow all those messages from all the religions without prejudice .
    Pray the way you always did, the way you learned it from your parents, but pray to God ,not to religion, God doesn’t need middle men.

  • Karen Schenk asked “Do you believe you can connect to God without religion?” Through meditation allowing a special visitation within Gods greater circle that was humbling to my very core I witnessed what happens to a persons essence (for some spirit or soul) at death. This is what I witnessed and learned. A person is allowed to see his total life from God’s vision of unconditional love. From this knowledge, he is able to understand his position in the kingdom. Our earthly purpose is to cleanse our essence and become one with God. My prayers are prayers of thanks for the numerous blessings on earth, given by God. My task is to cleanse my spirit (essence).

    The scriptures are confusing and misleading and the churches seek personal gain; thererfore, the only true path to God is direct and personal. I am truely a witness.

  • I can’t copy paste too long to type , can I email the reply What a karma yogi is?

  • Jamie Jamie says:

    Hi Krishan, thanks for including your thoughts here. When you say everything is cause and effects, does that mean that we have no choices in our lives, but only think, feel and act according to the causes in our lives? Can we choose how we respond to those causes?

    I am not sure what you mean by ‘trust in karmanyavadi’. Will you explain what that means?

  • Trust in karmanyavadi… Be a karma yogi… Everything is caouse and effects..

  • Tom Tom says:

    Ryu—
    I agree with you that God doesn’t want us to simply be “religious.” Following a religion as the way to God is fruitless. That’s because religion cannot remove the sins from us that separate us from God. However, this does not mean that we are not to join with other born again believers in Jesus Christ to fellowship and worship together. And that is typically done is a local Christian church.

    What about you Ryu—considering that Jesus says he is the only way to be right with God, have you believed in him and trusted in him alone to save you from God’s wrath?

  • Ryu says:

    Religion could really be a great foundation to mold your character, however, did God or Jesus require us to have or be in a religion? I think No, in fact Bible alone could already be your telephone to God. Religion will confuse you, will bring out debates with other religions, and brought more hate; that’s not what God wants us to do. Most people become more focus in their religion but forgot to focus to God. Do you know exactly why you want to be in heaven? there are no worldly materials there you can use, and even your opininions and religions are no longer important.

    I have reviewed so many religions, because God told us to research. But you know what, here’s what I have found, I keep on researching and looking for the best church or religion when in fact you can just directly talk to God, you can directly praise him. Tell him everyday you love HIM, you need HIM, and you miss HIM. Read the Bible to receive his message.

    When you go to heaven, God will never ever choose you because of your religion, there should be a connection with GOD. You should be there to praise HIM, serve HIM and love HIM. There is none you can do in heaven but just to be with GOD. There are no cars, there is no need for best clothes; your opinions, complaints, intelligence about religion, or intelligence about bible are no longer needed there; Serving and Loving HIM are just your main priorities.

  • Tom Tom says:

    Stephen—
    While I’m grateful that anyone desires to follow the Lord Jesus Christ and his teachings, I’m sorry that you find a discussion about these things with Christians so intimidating and a waste of time. Frankly I’m still puzzled as to why you profess to be such a follower of Jesus when all you know of him was written by the same sort of men that you totally distrust to have conveyed the truths of his teachings elsewhere in scripture. That’s illogical. What’s more, very little of what you’ve written seems to have been done in love for others and the sort of humility that Jesus taught.

    You mention that “No wonder non believers laugh at you, and rightfully so.” Since you make that statement and seem to believe that, and since you also are laughing at those who’ve tried to address your comments here, I would suppose that would make you an unbeliever as well.

    As for your name calling, you might want to revisit Jesus’ teaching in Matthew 5—“But I say to you that everyone who is angry with his brother shall be guilty before the court; and whoever says to his brother, ‘You good-for-nothing,’ shall be guilty before the supreme court; and whoever says, ‘You fool,’ shall be guilty enough to go into the fiery hell.” I think calling people stupid, brainwashed, blind, and in a previous post calling me an a** (in reference to the word “assume”), might just fall into this category of sin.

    Then again, Jesus is addressing brothers and sisters in Christ. Based on the fact you deny the validity and truth of the majority of scripture, calling them “dead letters and traditions of men,” I have no reason to believe you are, in fact, a born again believer in Jesus Christ. Therefore, you are to be pitied and prayed for. I’m sure many Christians who read your comments will be doing just that.

    Thanks for the last word.

  • Stephen says:

    Tom,
    I’m not mistaken at all. You throw the word “assembly” in front of the definition to justify what you call church. You’re doing it again, you claim that church are people but it’s obvious that all you care about is getting people into church buildings. You and others who have been brainwashed by worldly religion do the same thing with the word “word”. You give these words what ever definition suits your theology at the time.
    Jesus Christ calls His own out, religious “churches” call people into their buildings. It’s unfortunate you can’t see what’s right in front of your face. Jesus talks about these religious institutions in the parable of the seed sower. You’re part of the system that snatches up what The Holy Spirit puts in someone’s heart. You bind them to a book and religious dogma and take The Living Word out of them and fill them with dead letters and traditions of men. Sharon is a fine example this. She’s been brainwashed, oh sorry, indoctrinated since a young age and has never thought for herself. She, just like you, follow’s blindly. The blind leading the blind who in turn, lead the blind.
    You take care of yourself Tom, I’ve wasted enough time here. Differen’t people same religious spirit running in all “bible based churches” oh, sorry, people are the church, not buildings. Oh no, sorry, church sunday morning at 9 am. Oops, no, sorry, we are the church. Lol
    Do you have any idea just how stupid you folks look? No wonder non believers laugh at you, and rightfully so.
    There you have it, you get to have the last word because it’s all you care about, yourself.

  • Tom Tom says:

    Stephen–
    I think you are mistaken as my definition was “an assembly of called out ones.” Sounds the same to me.

    While there were pr0phets and others “called out” or “set apart” by God for special purposes in the Old Testament, the called-out saints in the New Testament are all part of the Church, the Body and Bride of Christ. By Church, I’m not referring to a building or a denomination, but the universal Church of believers.

  • Sharon says:

    to Stephen I am sorry you don’t believe ill give you that Luke didn’t walk with JESUS but JESUS did himself quote scripture read Luke 4 when he got tempted by the devil HE quoted scripture Matthew 4 4 from Deuteronomy 8 3 and when JESUS died HE said MY GOD WHY HAVE YOU FORSAKE ME HE was quoting Psalm 22 there are quite of old testament scriptures that JESUS said or fulfilled when HE was on this earth. you quote scripture but do you really KNOW it I grew up in a Christian home and I love my bible I know you probably don’t believe in prayer but I am praying for you whether you like it for not I just hope nothing bad happens to you I pray that God will open your eyes and when you die you don’t fall into the fires of hell that you repent before death. this is for me I am not commenting anymore you seem not to want to really listen– sharon

  • Stephen says:

    Tom,
    In Strong’s Greek Concordance, the word ekklesia (word #1577) is defined as “an assembly,” and it’s from the word “ek,” (word #1537) which means “out of”; and the word “klesis” (word #2821) which means “a calling.” So ekklesia means to be called out, and obviously Christ is the one that’s calling us out. But is that the first time we were ever called out?
    Your definition doesn’t match this definition? Is it only semantics? Or may it’s me that’s mistaken

  • Tom Tom says:

    Stephen–
    I’m sorry, but your position continues be very confusing to me. On the one hand you seem to deny the authority of the Bible, the Word of God, while at the same time profess to be a follower of Jesus who, with minor exceptions, you could only know about through the Bible (unless you’re professing to be “hearing” directly from Jesus?)

    Maybe you could clarify?

  • Tom Tom says:

    Mark—
    Thanks for your comments. It sounds like you’ve given these things much thought.

    You wrote, “I know there is God, I know there is only one, and I know that God created ALL human beings in his image and likeness.” Since this is the straight forward teaching we find ONLY in the Bible, Genesis most specifically, then I’m curious as to why you also wrote, “We don’t know what gave rise to actions that harm others on Earth . . .” The same Book of Genesis goes into detail as to why things are the way they are and why people do what they do. Have you studied that out?

    You also wrote, “This is not our fault and I don’t believe our Creator wants to punish us for failing to accurately describe what we cannot even perceive in our human state.” Since God has clearly revealed himself, our beginnings, his purpose for us, and what the future holds (again, all in the Bible), then I don’t agree that it’s not our fault that we don’t take him at his word and obey him. Paul, writing under the inspiration of God through the Holy Spirit wrote, “For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who suppress the truth in unrighteousness, because that which is known about God is evident within them; for God made it evident to them. For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse. For even though they knew God, they did not honor Him as God or give thanks, but they became futile in their speculations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Professing to be wise, they became fools, and exchanged the glory of the incorruptible God for an image in the form of corruptible man and of birds and four-footed animals and crawling creatures.” (Romans 1:18-23). It’s our own denial of the truths God has revealed to us that cause us to go off into all sorts of sinful directions and create man-made religions to suit our own purposes. Do we know all there is to know about God? Of course not. In fact, we can’t because God is infinite. But we can know all we need to know in order to be “right” with him and to have a relationship with him, and that’s through faith and trust in Jesus Christ.

    Are you reading the scriptures to find God’s heart and plan for you? 2 Timothy 3:16 tells us, “All Scripture is inspired (literally that means God-breathed) by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness; so that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work.”

  • Stephen says:

    Sharon,
    seems you’re accountable to your bible. Par for the course for a bible worshipping evangelical. Watch you don’t loose your book, you may loose your faith. You can assume all you want and use scripture to justify yourself, but you are correct on one point, you will stand before Jesus Christ on judgement day. He will say to many ” depart from me” who thought they were doing His will, but He will answer them “I never knew you”. Anyone can read the bible and think they are doing God’s will, but Jesus is The Word of God and His judgement stands, Jesus does not submit to bible verses or your interpretation of bible verses. You best figure that out before it’s to late.
    Luke was not a disciple of Jesus neither did he walk with Jesus. You’re indoctrination is a serious stumbling block to your relationship with Jesus. Jesus is not a book. Wake up

  • Sharon says:

    to Stephen Paul didn’t show up after JESUS died and rose again and wen to Heaven in Acts 9 and Luke was a doctor and in Acts 1 it says dear Theophilus in my first book meaning Luke so he was with JESUS on earth while Jesus walked the earth those three years I know JESUS said I will reveal to those who love me but JESUS did tell peter on my rock I will build my church I am sorry you don’t believe this I know I don’t have to justify myself to you anyone. I am accountable to God only. sharon

  • Stephen says:

    Jesus bless you much Mark.
    Peace and Love

  • Mark says:

    I grew up in a Catholic family and attended church regularly. However recently I have had more expansive thoughts about our Creator as I call God now. My knowledge and study of science has me believe that the complexity and infinity of our Universe is not accidental. It was created with rules and order more complex than we can ever understand.

    I know there is God, I know there is only one, and I know that God created ALL human beings in his image and likeness. All of us have something deep inside us that leans toward the spiritual and marvels at the infinite. All human civilizations have felt this innate spirituality and have done things to celebrate it in deference to that higher power that we all feel.

    Yet without criticizing all the difference recognized religious and spiritual practices human beings have formed a number of belief systems to try to understand who we are and how we came to be. We want to know that which gave way to our lives and consciousness and we want to know that someday we will be united with that force which breathed life into each of us.

    God is much larger than the good or bad we do during the time of our lives. Those who we believe are destined for punishment by God may be spared. We don’t know what gave rise to actions that harm others on Earth and God will be the arbiter of those decisions. We can be absolutely certain that any talents or abilities we have for good are infinitely small compared to the abilities of that which created all of us.

    We are first and foremost human beings; made by our Creator. Distantly second we are Christian, Jewish, Taoist, Muslim, etc. There is only one Creator, but we as human beings have come up with many explanations of our Creator. I tend to believe that some our ideas about our Creator are correct, but many are wrong as we will see someday.

    This is not our fault and I don’t believe our Creator wants to punish us for failing to accurately describe what we cannot even perceive in our human state. We know there is something incredible on the other side of that frosted glass window, yet none of us can clearly see what it is and we have devised many explanations as to what it might be.

    Regardless of our religious preferences, we should treat each other as well as we can and help and protect one another. We should thank our Creator for our lives, thankfully use the things that our Creator has provided for our lives, and take care of the things that the Creator has given to us. Our Creator loves us infinitely more than a mother can love her own child and we should never forget that.

  • Stephen says:

    Yes my mistake about Peter, I was thinking Luke.
    As for Peter being “the rock” and you’re assumption that what Paul says is what Jesus says, is in error. The spirit of Truth guides us into all Truth.
    Who was it that revealed to Peter who Jesus was? “Flesh and blood has not REVEALED this to you” It was The Father, not a man which coincides with what Jesus said when He said, ” No man comes to Me less The Father draw him”. Jesus Himself said He would REVEAL Himself to those who Love Him.
    The rock is REVELATION that Jesus builds HIS body on.

  • Sharon says:

    to Stephen john and peter both followed Jesus after Jesus died it was peter and john running to the grave and JESUS also said during the three years of HIS life to peter on this church will I build my church which is peter called the rock. in Ephesians 4 11 is the gifts one is pastors aka shepherds and also Hebrews 10 don’t give up meeting as some are in the habit of doing also in romans 16 1 it says I comment to you phoebe a sister of the church at Cenchreae church is the body of believers also in 2 timothy 2 2 about faithful men who teach others– sharon

  • Tom Tom says:

    Stephen—
    Sorry if my “assumption” was incorrect, but your apparent disdain for the local church seemed to me to indicate a previous bad experience.

    The New Testament Greek word for “church” is “ekklesia” and by definition is “an assembly of called out ones.” An assembly means a group gathering, so they were typically meeting altogether. Where were they meeting? Acts 2:46 tells us, “And they, continuing daily with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house . . .” So they were daily meeting in the temple—a building which would house that many people—as well as having daily devotional meetings in smaller groups in various houses. Today’s church buildings are simply meeting houses for believers. Granted, there is maintenance and upkeep which those meeting in the existing temple didn’t have to incur (assuming they didn’t have to pay a temple tax with each meeting) but with growth there comes administrative challenges. (See Acts 6:1-10). I see nothing intrinsically wrong with having a building in which to meet. The Lord laid out the plans for the temple for Jewish believers (which cost millions of dollars by the way) and that temple even represents the temple in which God resides in heaven. I’d say that’s a pretty good basis for the Lord approving of our having a church building of some sort, as long as we don’t use it simply for show.

    I don’t agree with your claim that the church was not an organization. What is an organization? Isn’t it a group of people “organized” in some fashion to perform some function? Isn’t that exactly what the church, the ekklesia, was, and is, all about? Ephesians 4:11-12 says, “So Christ himself gave the apostles, the prophets, the evangelists, the pastors and teachers, to equip his people for works of service, so that the body of Christ may be built up.” In Acts 6, the beginnings of administrative organization are seen with the appointing of seven men to “serve tables,” in order that the apostles could continue their given work of prayer and the word of God.” (If they were “serving tables,” it was probably within a building.)

    I may be misunderstanding you here, but if you’re suggesting we must “hear” directly from Jesus to know any truth is not scriptural. Yes, Jesus is the source of all truth, and granted, Jesus himself said in John 14:26, “But the Advocate, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you.” But if teachers and pastors aren’t to convey the word of God as well, why did Christ give them to the church? Consider, too, that the Word of God, the Bible, is 100% ALL from Jesus himself. Jesus IS the very Word of God, and the Holy Spirit is the one who conveys the truth of the Word of God to our spirit. But the Spirit uses many means by which to do so, and that includes the pastors and teachers that Jesus has given to the church, as well as the “book,” the Bible.

    Acts 2:45 states, “They sold property and possessions to give to anyone who had need.” In context, the ones in need were members of the new church, the body of believers who were meeting together. Acts 4:34-35 tells us, “For from time to time those who owned land or houses sold them, brought the money from the sales, and put it at the apostles’ feet, and it was distributed to anyone who had need.” So we see that as needs arose, believers brought money to be used to meet those needs. As the church continued to grow and outgrow the existing synagogues (buildings) which were already in existence, it would only make sense that meeting places would be built specifically for the Christian worship of God. Along with that would obviously come the need for funds for upkeep.

    I think it’s important to keep the times, logistics, cultural, and societal differences in mind. We aren’t living in first-century Jerusalem. We have expenses of living that those folks didn’t have. In particular in developed nations, pastors have such things as vehicle expenses, housing expenses, utility bills, etc. which most of those early church pastors didn’t have. I see no reason not to expect church members to pay something to their shepherds. And remember, they ARE shepherds. Jesus said to Peter, “Feed my sheep.” He’s talking about pastoring. He also said, “The workman is worthy of his wages.”

    As for your last statement, Paul was given specific and direct revelation of Jesus Christ by Christ himself on the Damascus Road. Then Jesus said to Ananias about Paul, “But the Lord said to him, “Go, for he is a chosen instrument of mine, to bear my name before the Gentiles and kings and the sons of Israel; for I will show him how much he must suffer for my name’s sake.” (Acts 9:15ff) That sure sounds to me like Jesus had some direct input for Paul. And as for Peter, I can’t believe you mean that Peter didn’t learn from Jesus directly. He was, after all, one of the first apostles Jesus called to walk with him and was one of the “inner circle” of three—James, John, and Peter.

  • Stephen says:

    “It sounds as if you’ve been hurt by some church or organization.”, the classic evangelical script. LMAO, I have never been part of a religious organization, unless you count attending catholic church a handful of times as a youth. I can assure you, i didn’t have a clue what was being said, let alone having them “hurt me” as you like to assume. You know what they say about “assume” don’t you?
    Seems your discernment is way off.
    Now can you please point me to which chapter of the book acts speaks about giving money to an organization called “church” and where such “church” used the money to build buildings and pay for clergy. Thanks in advance.

    Based on your statement “Based on your statements, do you disagree with the first five chapters of Acts which talk much about individuals giving generously and sacrificially to the church so that all might have their needs met?” It seems obvious that the “church” spoken about is people and not an organization. It is also a fact that the word “church” only appears one time in the first five book of acts.
    So your claim is simply that, your claim.

    Based on your statement “Based on your statements, are you discarding much of the Epistles of Paul and Peter because they are “religious leaders” telling Christians what they should do?”
    Can you please tell me who taught Paul? Was Paul not taught according to how Jesus said we would be taught? Did Jesus tell us that man or a book would teach us? The answer is NO, John said that “you need that no man teach you” and Jesus Himself said “the spirit of truth will guide you into all truth. He shall glorify Me”
    Are you discarding what Jesus said to follow a mere man who was blessed with the spirit of Christ?
    Neither Paul or Peter walked with Jesus Christ, but John did. Peter was a disciple of Paul. Is Paul Jesus Christ?

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